my bloody valentine

everything else

Moderator: Paquito

Post Reply
User avatar
crystalball
Posts: 5197
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2007 18:04
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/felters
Location: That London
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by crystalball » Fri Jun 27, 2008 14:52

Trev Lostmusic wrote:
crystalball wrote:f I could hear the vocals a bit more I wouldn't have felt the same way and I've no idea if that was deliberate or not.
MBV and vocals - this I do remember - you could never hear what they were singing live - so I wasn't expecting to hear much this time around.
I like hazy, ethereal, quiet vocals too but on Saturday you couldn't even tell they were singing. Maybe it was just a particularly bad night.

linus

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by linus » Fri Jun 27, 2008 14:55

but do MBV sound unsafe, trev?

are they a challenging listen?

if it's great loud pop or rock, then fine, but I perceive a sense that MBV are venerated beyond that, that the mythos surrounding them which has built up from the recording of 'loveless' onwards and the perception of what MBV mean and are and all that flannel has put them in the 'historia de la musica rock' category but with the added twaddle that their 'sonic architects' or 'noise sculptors' or somesuch

they've been elevated so high that, well, cynics may well cock a snook in their direction

the claims made for MBV then and now may well be to their disadvantage, that's my, um, whatchamacallit

User avatar
Trev
Posts: 6877
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2007 10:56
Last.fm: lostmusic
Location: Cardiff
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by Trev » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:09

linus wrote:but do MBV sound unsafe, trev?

are they a challenging listen?
It was less safe than most bands I have seen lately. But I don't think many (any?) guitar bands can be called unsafe in 2008.
not really here

linus

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by linus » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:15

unless they're playing with an amp resting unsteadily on the edge of a filled bath and the wiring into the amp is a bit dodgy anyway and there's a lot of jumping around making the amp unsteadier still

and perhaps somebody has spilled some oil on the stage

and it's raining

and there's a bomb

User avatar
crystalball
Posts: 5197
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2007 18:04
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/felters
Location: That London
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by crystalball » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:15

The thing is though, when they were playing loud back at the time, that was a statement, it meant something. Now it's just a trademark, something they do because it's what people who paid 25 quid expect. And in that sense it's safer than any indiepop gig I've ever seen.

linus

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by linus » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:19

would you say, marianthi, that the 'noise/feedback' thing might be perceived to be a macho endurance thing?

because that completely turns what MBV used to signify upside down

and indeed the whole feedback, noise thing to some degree

bocken
Posts: 443
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 11:58
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/
Location: N8.
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by bocken » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:28

linus wrote:would you say, marianthi, that the 'noise/feedback' thing might be perceived to be a macho endurance thing?

because that completely turns what MBV used to signify upside down

and indeed the whole feedback, noise thing to some degree
I don't think that was their intention though - there's an interview on the xfm website where Colm's saying that the gigs after the ICA will be better because the PA will be a lot better, and that they they're not out to ruin people's hearing with loads of high-end noise, it's the low frequencies that physically hit you that cause the sensations. They were giving out earplugs at the gigs after all.

User avatar
Trev
Posts: 6877
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2007 10:56
Last.fm: lostmusic
Location: Cardiff
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by Trev » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:30

crystalball wrote:The thing is though, when they were playing loud back at the time, that was a statement, it meant something. Now it's just a trademark, something they do because it's what people who paid 25 quid expect. And in that sense it's safer than any indiepop gig I've ever seen.
But it's exactly what they were doing 16 years ago. So it's the same statement!

As for indiepop and safe. Come on - twee pop songs are just an update on Buddy Holly - surely? They're great and they're fun - but guitar based pop can be nothing other than safe/conservative soundwise in 2008. The DIY ethics has nothing to do with the way it sounds.
not really here

linus

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by linus » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:31

so it's deb that's delivering the sonic body blows... allllriiiight!

\w/

does she still play with her trademark bass stance... I'm not sure how to describe it... she's basically pummelling the bass into submission with a purposeful intent

User avatar
humblebee
Posts: 10543
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 16:33
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/atomicbeatboy
Location: Sheffields
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by humblebee » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:34

linus wrote:would you say, marianthi, that the 'noise/feedback' thing might be perceived to be a macho endurance thing?

because that completely turns what MBV used to signify upside down
It sounds like it, doesn't it? But it would be completely of a piece with the band's appropriation into the Mojo anals of fame. Go on last.fm or whatever and all the MBV listeners now, their other top bands are all blokerock bluster and the Valentines slip right in between Radiohead and the Red Hot Chilli Peppers. I'm not just saying this because of the tour. I always thought Loveless was crap.
Trev Lostmusic wrote:But it's exactly what they were doing 16 years ago. So it's the same statement!
No, because meaning is dependent on context, so one constant thing has a different meaning at different times. In this context a sound that stays the same means something different as time passes and the rest of music moves on, and it usually means less and becomes less potent.
Last edited by humblebee on Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:36, edited 1 time in total.

bocken
Posts: 443
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 11:58
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/
Location: N8.
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by bocken » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:36

linus wrote:so it's deb that's delivering the sonic body blows... allllriiiight!

\w/

does she still play with her trademark bass stance... I'm not sure how to describe it... she's basically pummelling the bass into submission with a purposeful intent
Yeah, that's right.

aside: I saw Snowpony in 1999, and it was pretty fantastic standing right at the front of the stage and she was pummelling away at the bass and it was really loud and I thought they were great, but I have a feeling they probably weren't that great. The album certainly wasn't bassy enough.

SophieC
Posts: 3979
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2007 19:36
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/jamiec
Location: bumtown

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by SophieC » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:40

you want unsafe? you want noise? buy a buy-to-let house under the heathrow flightpath.

this is purely personal and i'm not having a dig, but the mental equatation that happens in my brain when i hear music that can be classified as 'ethereal', be it later MBV, a multitude of shoegaze chancers, the cocteau twins and all the 4AD stuff, the orb, chillout music, that bloke i saw in a pub who just wanged a single note on his guitar and let it drone on for twenty minutes, all those clever but tuneless folkers = v. boring. when i encounter music like this at gigs i usually spend my time looking round at the collective enraptured faces wondering what exactly they're getting from it. i feel like an aethist at a funeral half heartedly mumbling hymns.

actually maybe i should give MBV another chance, it's just the minute someone canonises music i'm immediately put off by it. probably because i'm akward and ridiculous. sometimes i think i only listen to music because i'm trying to capture how i felt when i listened to 'singles' by the smiths aged 16.
When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called 'the People's Stick.'

User avatar
Trev
Posts: 6877
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2007 10:56
Last.fm: lostmusic
Location: Cardiff
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by Trev » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:43

humblebee wrote:
Trev Lostmusic wrote:But it's exactly what they were doing 16 years ago. So it's the same statement!
No, because meaning is dependent on context, so one constant thing has a different meaning at different times.
The context is they're playing a gig. They sound damn similar to they did in 1992. If people perceive it differently - it's not the bands fault - is it?

I saw them in 87, 90, 92 and again last week - and the comparisons between 92 and last week is that the band were loud. They were louder in 92. Audience reaction was different - but again - this isn't the bands fault - is it?
not really here

bocken
Posts: 443
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 11:58
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/
Location: N8.
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by bocken » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:43

humblebee wrote:Go on last.fm or whatever and all the MBV listeners now, their other top bands are all blokerock bluster and the Valentines slip right in between Radiohead and the Red Hot Chilli Peppers.
I think you're reaching a bit here.

http://www.last.fm/music/My+Bloody+Valentine/+similar" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

JamieC wrote:actually maybe i should give MBV another chance, it's just the minute someone canonises music i'm immediately put off by it.
Good job the Smiths were never put in any canons.
Last edited by bocken on Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:44, edited 2 times in total.

a layer of chips
Posts: 18616
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 09:17
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/
Location: Nottingham, UK
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by a layer of chips » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:44

Don't listen to Jamie. He'a got a Moose record.

I thought MBV were a bit shit live first time round. Much better on record. I'm not interested that "being loud" is their schtick. That seems a a bit boring to me. Having some equipment to make your guitars sound louder doesn't exactly scream POP MUSIC to me.

User avatar
crystalball
Posts: 5197
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2007 18:04
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/felters
Location: That London
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by crystalball » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:45

Trev Lostmusic wrote:
But it's exactly what they were doing 16 years ago. So it's the same statement!
I really don't mean to go on about it because I know that the vast majority of people enjoyed the shows immensely so I'm in the minority here, but since we're having this discussion, I don't think it's the same statement - in fact I don't think it's a statement at all. Like linus said, they are just another rock myth now and to me it felt like they were cashing in on that.

User avatar
grumpytimes
Posts: 429
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:14
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/chrishafa
Location: Auckland
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by grumpytimes » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:50

I did feel the 'holocaust' bit looses its effect when it's clear everyone is going to stay to the end and anyone who says "fuck this" will be dismissed. To me it's the kind of thing that should be divisive, but obvouisly isn't when everyone's payed £25 and their name is up in lights.

Regarding the safe/unsafe they did play exactly how most people expecting them to. If instead of doing the holocaust they launched into 'paint a rainbow' that would have been 'unsafe'. There is challanging guitar music being made in 2008 by bands like Wolf Eyes and all those other free noise people, but I don't think indiepop can really be classed as one or the other.

I must say being able to hear Deb and Colm was probably my favourite thing about the shows.

User avatar
annie
Posts: 284
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 17:45
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/andyandannie
Location: london

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by annie » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:50

humblebee wrote:No, because meaning is dependent on context, so one constant thing has a different meaning at different times. In this context a sound that stays the same means something different as time passes and the rest of music moves on, and it usually means less and becomes less potent.
i see what you mean, and i wish they'd played some of their supposed new (well, for all i know the 'new' songs were written a decade ago) material, as it would've been interesting so see what it's like.
incidentally, i think what you've written applies to about 95% of the 'new' bands people get excited about in the indiepop forum, and it's why i haven't been able to get excited about indiepop for a while now. but that's for another discussion altogether!
Last edited by annie on Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:51, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
humblebee
Posts: 10543
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 16:33
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/atomicbeatboy
Location: Sheffields
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by humblebee » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:51

Trev Lostmusic wrote:The context is they're playing a gig. They sound damn similar to they did in 1992. If people perceive it differently - it's not the bands fault - is it?

I saw them in 87, 90, 92 and again last week - and the comparisons between 92 and last week is that the band were loud. They were louder in 92. Audience reaction was different - but again - this isn't the bands fault - is it?
Isn't it?

They've chosen to come back, and they've chosen (I think!) not to do new stuff, not engage with or relate or respond to anything that's happened since '92. Fair enough, 's up to them, etc etc. But if they seem less vital or distinctive or inspiring or necessary than they did when you saw them back in the day (yer lucky bleeder!) then it's because of decisions that the band themselves have taken and did not have to take. They can't be absolved of all responsibility for how they are heard.
Last edited by humblebee on Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:53, edited 1 time in total.

a layer of chips
Posts: 18616
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 09:17
Last.fm: http://www.last.fm/user/
Location: Nottingham, UK
Contact:

Re: my bloody valentine

Post by a layer of chips » Fri Jun 27, 2008 15:52

Still, "You Made Me Realise" is fucking ace, isn't it? That'll never change.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests